
Francisco Mela Interview
FRANCISCO MELA INTERVIEW
Just one week before his performance at the Vision Festival, the renowned drummer Francisco Mela granted us the privilege of sitting down with him for a little while. He shared fascinating thoughts and reflections about his career, his experience, and his worldview. It was a true pleasure to listen to the maestro.
We hope you enjoy it just as much—or even more!

LISTEN TO THE PODCAST HERE BELOW
In&OutJazz: ¡Francisco!
Francisco Mela: ¿Quién habla ahí?
¡Hombre, qué alegría! ¡Mírale! Con la batería y todo detrás, ¡ole, ole!
¿Cómo estamos?
Nos saludamos en español y ahora le damos al inglés para que la gente lo agradezca. ¿Estás todo bien? ¿Estás en Boston, no?
Estoy aquí en Boston, sí.
¡Qué bueno!
Dime tu nombre otra vez, caballero, ¿qué es el nombre?
José. Ahí lo tienes que ver también en la ventanita.
Ah, ok, José, José. Pues, José, mucho gusto y gracias por la oportunidad.
Gracias a ti, gracias a ti. Vamos a darle ya al inglés. Let’s go, let’s go ahead. Man, it’s a real pleasure as always. We’ve had contact with you since a long time ago. I remember a nice interview with Begoña during COVID, right? In quarantine, in those times back then. And anyways, you know us already. We are an independent journal from Madrid, based in Madrid, with a lot of collaborators working to focus on the avant-garde musicians and music that is going on in this era. And Francisco Mela is such a big name, such a name, such a name for a lot of people. And of course, we do also recognize it as a big name in the music realm. And therefore, in a holistic perspective, as a human being too. Because of your artistry, because of your musicianship, and a long list that goes on. Also, you’ve done a lot of collaborations, a lot of records, a lot of music throughout your whole career. You’ve had a long career and I hope it still goes on for a long time. Anyways, thank you for being with us, it’s such an honor. We’re going to head straight to the interview. I’m going to throw you the first question. Really easy one. How are you doing? You’re at the moment in Boston. What are you up to these days? How are you feeling?
Well, well, Jose, first of all, thank you so much for the invitation. And thank you so much for all those words that you proclaimed. I didn’t know that you guys had that estimation, and that concept about me, but thank you so much. Well, to answer your question, yeah, I’m in Boston. Boston is my home base. It’s a home base because now I’m super happy to be here after moving from New York. During the COVID, you know, that was very… let’s say it was terrible. And so, I’ve been always teaching at Berklee and the commute is four hours, Boston-New York. And so, with my wife, we decided that I shouldn’t do this trip every week because I was going every week, Boston-New York.
Right.
Eight hours.
And were you catching the bus or were you doing the flight?
No, no, never fly, because fly makes me crazy.
I see.
Bus and train. And so, I’ve been here teaching. What I am up to is to create a scene here with the people that’s around me and playing music and sharing music.
Would you state that you’re a followed musician in the music scene in the States, in Boston?
The question is if people follow me or if I follow people?
Right, right. I mean, I guess the right answer to that question is yes, totally. But how do you deal with that? With the fact that you are a followed musician, a musician that actually influences the scene in which he’s living at the moment?
Well, I gotta tell you, it’s been great. I don’t know if they follow me or I follow them. But what I really know for real is that we all inspire each other. And so, we have great musicians here in Boston too. But to talk about the followers, well, I have the avant-garde community at Berklee College Music of Boston that is really growing. And somehow, Jose, I think that I’ve been pushing, because now I have two masterclass ensembles that I teach avant-garde.
Nice.
And it’s a lot of people, a lot of people that are great, and people playing differently now. They used to play one way [rigid, stiff and closed], but they now play like these multiple ways [circular-motioned, opened, free]. And so, I think that I’m inspiring some people. I mean, I’m 57 years old now, I’m not a kid no more. And so, I think that they listen to me a little bit.
Yeah, it’s natural. It’s a natural evolution. But we are thankful for that fact. Tell us a little bit about your coming shows at the Vision Festival. Are you excited for that?
That is amazing, Jose.
That’s taking place very soon, right?
Yeah! June 6th! We want to be at the Vision Festival. And when I say we, it’s because when they asked me to present something, the first thing that I talked about was The Fringe. The Fringe is the band with George Garzone, the legendary George Garzone and John Lockwood, and the drummer who passed away three years ago, Bob Gullotti, he’s a legend there. They had this band for like 50 years, not 40, not 30… 50 years!!!
Look at that.
And so I got super lucky, Jose, because right when I moved to Boston, they asked if I wanted to join them. And I was like “my gosh, are you crazy?” And so, when Vision Festival asked me to do something on my own, I said “I can’t do this without the people that I play every Monday with!” Cause I’ve been playing for three years that I’m here now, every single Monday. And so, this is an opportunity for me, for the band, and also for George Garzone, that is a well-known, super amazing master. And I know it’s on the rate, people don’t really recognize him as the greatest that he is. And when they heard about it, they were very happy and the Vision Festival is super happy. And so, we’re going to have a minute over there, a presentation. We play every Monday, so by playing every Monday, you know how much we have to rehearsed!!? We are totally ready to go and knock out that stage.
It sounds amazing, man. I’m really looking forward to hear about your shows at the Vision Festival. It sounds exciting. Tell us a little bit more about, yeah, your trio projects and and the music you’re working on at the moment. What is the engine that draws you to make up that kind of music you make? Tell us a little bit about that music.
This is amazing. And thank you for asking me this question, Jose. I played with McCoy Tyner for 10 years, right? In 10 years, a lot of things happen, right? And so, we used to play every month, the fourth Monday. Playing with McCoy every month, the fourth Monday. It’s amazing because, McCoy wouldn’t travel that much. And so, a lot of people came. And I just want to mention two people that came. I mean, besides the big amount of people and great musicians that came. Well, you’re a drummer, let me tell you this. Imagine I’m ready to play at the Blue Note in New York. McCoy Tyner over there on the stage ready to hit. And you see a family coming and just going back and sitting down the table behind me. The grandpa, the sons, the three kids, the grandons, and all them are musicians, singers… And I started panicking like this. Can you tell me who they were? 99 years old, the drummer and his family.
I mean, if he was not the master, Roy Haynes…
Yes! Can you believe that, Jose?
Marcus and so on…
Marcus and his two songs, Craig and Graham, the trumpet player, and Leslie, the daughter, they walk like…
All the masters.
They just came to celebrate Roy Haynes’ birthday, which was that same day.
Yeah.
Oh my gosh, amazing. So, that’s one thing. Why did I get this direction? Now, well, being with McCoy, I remember that after the show, we finished, we went upstairs for the dinner and someone knocks the door… I always liked to stay with McCoy. The other musicians were in the other room, I’m wanting to be with the master. Taking care of him, “oh, do you need something? If you need anything, let me know”
That’s how you learn, man.
Someone knocks the door. “Come on in”, says McCoy. I open the door, okay. “Hey, McCoy”, says this other great piano player, amazing, another master. When I saw that guy, I was like, “Jesus!”. He looked like a baby, “McCoy, amazing seeing you, blah, blah, blah, blah, always great, you’re such an inspiration, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah”. And McCoy’s sits like this, all calmed and serious, “thank you, thank you”. “Well, McCoy, I’m going to leave you alone, I gotta go, but I hope to see you soon, keep inspiring people, bye!”. He left, I closed the door and I said “McCoy didn’t you recognize that person?” McCoy said to me, all serious “I remember seeing the three of them in the front row listening to the quartet”.
Nice!
But this is only one person, who were the other two? Keith Jarret, Herbie Hancock and that guy, Chick Corea.
Look at that! I mean the three big masters, man.
The three big men. But Chick was there, and I haven’t finished. He came as I told you, looking excited like a little kid…
Right!
And I kept telling McCoy how great Chick is, all the contributions he has made… But McCoy stayed cool. And there’s another Monday, one of those months. I’m with McCoy again, and someone knocks the door. “Come on in”, says McCoy. W
Who knocked the door?
Yeah, I opened the door. There’s a little and short black guy, even shorter than me. With dreadlocks, sunglasses and a little hat, a little boina. Now, McCoy grabs the man, jumps to him, “my gosh, you’re welcomed, what an honor to have you here, blah blah blah”.
Yeah, all excited.
And I still didn’t know who the guy was. They greet each other and say bye, I close the door and I asked McCoy “who’s that person?”. And he answered “I wish I was that free… Cecil Taylor”
Oh, wow…
“Cecil Taylor, that’s the guy, Cecil Taylor!!!!” Because I never saw him before.
Okay.
Oh my gosh. And so, after that McCoy started showing me signals that he wanted to be free.
I get it.
But he wasn’t free like Cecil Taylor, but he really admired those avant-garde people. And so, just to answer the question of why I got this direction in music… When we went to Japan with McCoy, and I played very bad because Lewis Nash was in the audience with his girlfriend, and I got panicked cause I have big respect for Lewis Nash. And I was “oh my god!!”…, I couldn’t play, I couldn’t swing, I couldn’t do anything. And McCoy is like, “what’s wrong?” I said, “McCoy, send me back to New York”. He asked, “Why? What happened?”. I told him “You have Lewis Nash there, I don’t need to be here, man, you got him, like a real afro-american drummer”. He said “No!!! I need you, I need you to grow with me”
Wow!
“I have nothing to teach Lewis Nash. If I wanted him, he would be here with me, but I need you, because you are gonna pass this to the next generation.
Right!
I’ll never forget this. He said, “Mela, you play with McCoy Tyner!!! Free yourself!! We play music to free our souls!” So, when McCoy died, I became a free musician.
Look at that!!!
I went to look for William Parker, Patricia Parker, Cooper Moore…
Yeah, all the fathers of the Free.
All those guys. And I became part of the community. And now I haven’t grown so much in that community because once I started being part of them I left and came to Boston. But can you see that? They still remember me, they still like me, they still love me and they call me “Mela, you want to do something?” And that’s why I became a free musician. And I’m not even focused on the Cuban or the Jazz no more. Because the Cuban and the Jazz is all there, it’s all there.
I get it, yeah.
I don’t need to know the “chinkling chinkling”, or the “tumpa cutika cutukumba”, no, no. Let’s play free and in the free you get all that. And that video that Begoña posted reflects everything. Reflects the timba, the jazz, the freedom, you know what I mean?
I know, it’s beautiful. If listened to that video many times, yeah.
That video…, that is who I am, all ingredients right there.


Wow, man thank you so much for showing us all the history behind your life, man. And your relationship with music itself. It’s really moving, man and it really touched me a lot, thank you so much.
It’s my pleasure.
I was in fact about to ask you what was the purpose behind your music or if there was any conceptual or spiritual research behind and beyond. But I guess you’ve already almost answered that question too with everything you just said and everything that you pictured: all the moments, all the experiences with McCoy and, you know, all your life experience. So, yeah thank you so much, man. Would you give any tip any must-do or must-receive tip to young drummers nowadays. Me being one hahaha. Or even…, let me let me bet a little higher. Would you recommend us all to, you know, dive in into the free world or would you invite us to do the whole process till we get there? Or would…, yeah I don’t know…, maybe that’s a very bold question to ask but I’d like to hear your thoughts.
I can do it. You just asked me two questions. One is to give an advice for the new generation and the other is what would be the map to get to that art form of free.
Yeah, exactly.
Well, let’s start with this. I, with the experience that I’m having right now with my students and with the spirit that I had myself, I remember that when I decided to be a free musician it was because I used to play at Smalls Jazz Club in New York with these people: Eric Wyatt and Benito González and then a drummer, avant-garde drummer from the new generation, Gerald Cleaver was there and he called me and said “Mela, come here bro. You shouldn’t be…, you are not there, you are not one of them, you are one us!!”. And I said “What do you mean?”, and he goes “Bro, the way that you play is so free that you have to be a free musician!! How do you play swing like that, so crazy?” So I said “I don’t know…this is just how I do it…”, and he said “bro, I’m gonna call William Parker tomorrow and I’m gonna tell him that you need to be here, bro. We need more people like you in our side!!!”. That thing encouraged me so much that I was like wow!!! It made me feel so good that now I will tell you, it is never late to start exploring being a free musician. Why? Because jazz or to be a swinger is one style but to be free is all the styles.
Wow.
What do you want to be called? “Hey this is the swinger”. Okay, but they don’t want to call you to play only swing, you know. But when you are an avant-garde you don’t care… No, “you don’t care” is not correct. Because you have the avant-garde of the free mind, because it’s all mental, the free approach. Now if you were afraid to play swing properly, “chin-chinquilin-chinquilin…etc.”, now when you become a free musician you just play “di.dididi-dididi…etc.” If you wanna play avant-garde and you were thinking that by playing afrocuban [sings pattern], it was hard to sound like that…, now because you are an avant-garde, you play [sings other patterns, more fluid and less stiff] and you’re free. So, I recommend anyone of any age to explore it. Because for everyone it’s different and it hits deeply in a different way to anyone. The bad thing will be not to try, not to experience. But if you try and it hits you like really deeply, it’s because you… Well, something that I remember and I always share with my students is what Gary Peacock said. Gary Peacock said that when he came to New York, he was playing with a lot of people from the avant-garde music, but everybody was playing like this [stiff]. But when he met Paul Motian, he understood that avant-garde music is not something that you learn, it’s something that you are.
Oh, wow, yeah, it makes sense.
And so, maybe you don’t know, people don’t know that they are avant-garde inside.
Right.
You just have to try. Maybe you are not, and so it’s okay. That’s why I say to my students, I’m not teaching this lab or this masterclass to make you or to convert you into an avant-garde musician. I’m just sharing this with you, just to have another tool to experience music in different way. And so, I recommend free jazz music to everyone. McCoy told me “We play music to free our souls”. And let me show you this. I forgot to show you. You have one second?
Yeah, yeah, yeah, right, right, right. I’ll hold on.
Okay, Jose, check this out [shows a vinyl record of his]. This was the first one, Music frees our souls, dedicated to McCoy Tyner, with Matthew Sheep and William Parker and myself. This is volume one. Now, volume two, with different people with Cooper Moore, the same bass player, William Parker. And then the third one.
Oh, man, amazing.
Always with a new great pianist guest and with William.
Your trio projects, right?
You remember? Oh right, you guys put this out, remember?
Right.
Yeah, this was a dedication to McCoy. Different piano players. The same bass player of Cecil Taylor, William Parker.
Yeah.
But a different piano player, just to show the versatility of McCoy. But that, Jose, is my answer to the first question. Now, I have to share you the second answer for the question about the advice for the new generation… Well, I went to the neighboring Regattabar Club here in Boston to watch and listen to Elvin Jones, here in Boston, at the Club Regattabar.
Okay.
Amazing. And I went there and I got to tell you, I didn’t understand anything because, believe it or not, even if Elvin wasn’t a free jazz musician, his approach was free.
Wow.
It’s amazing how you start to, by investigating, now the result of the calculation is that, yeah, McCoy, the way that he played, he was free, but he didn’t jump into the swimming pool.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Elvin Jones, the way that he played, all his triplets, all these things, he wasn’t playing like, like, like. Well.
Yeah, the pattern or whatever, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Exactly, he wasn’t playing like all closed.
Yeah, it’s all open.
Yeah, you know what I mean?
And I love how you’re doing all these movements because when you do like that, it’s like all rigid, and then you do all the circle movements and it’s clear you mean free and all the dancing…
Well, and so after that, I asked him “Master, Elvin, I didn’t understand what you played, but I love it, it resonates in my heart so much. What is an advice that you can give me?” and he said, “Well, you are a new drummer, let me tell you this, it’s easier to impress than to play good”. So, me dijo, es más fácil impresionar que tocar bien. “So, make sure that you play good, don’t try to impress nobody”.
Oh, beautiful. Man, look at that, no more words. No need of more words. Look at that, man. Francisco, ¡Qué placer! What a pleasure, man. I would, I would stay here longer, hours and hours hearing you talk. I think people are going to fall in love with you if they didn’t already. People are going to feel your vibe, feel your spirit, feel your kindness. And I’m so thankful for having had this brief conversation. But, you know, as we say in Spain, “lo bueno y breve, dos veces bueno”. So, good and bried is twice as good.
Right.
So, man, thank you so much. We will hand this beautiful conversation to our people here in Madrid and beyond our country, and we hope people can get to know you and your music better and that they can check you out because, if they haven’t done it already, they’re missing a very beautiful thing, and a very beautiful human being too. So, thank you so much, man. We’ll be in contact and, and we’ll try to catch up with all your Vision Festival show and all your music, all the music you put out and all the energy that you carry with yourself, man. I hope everything goes well. Uh, I wish you the best. We wish you the best from the journal, and thanks so much for tuning in, man.
My pleasure, man. It’s a, it’s an honor for me that you took a moment off your busy schedule to share with me and asking me this questions.
My pleasure, man, my pleasure.
I would love to see you in Madrid. Begoña and I…, we’ve been talking about how to get in contact. I was supposed to go but… there is a phrase in English that goes like this: It’s not about the money, it’s about the money.
Hahaha.
And so, I’m just looking for the right one who’s going to pay the right money in order for me to go there and spend time, man.
We’re looking forward to that, totally. So cool. Man, huge hugs from Madrid and see you soon, for sure. I hope that takes place soon.
Much love.
Gracias, bye.

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